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From: kikuchi@astro.isas.jaxa.jp
Subject: Cross region ARF
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Date: Fri, 25 May 2018 07:07:56 GMT
From: kikuchi@astro.isas.jaxa.jp
To: xmmhelp@sciops.esa.int
CC: kikuchi@astro.isas.jaxa.jp
Subject: Cross region ARF
Full_Name: Takahiro Kikuchi
Submission from: (NULL) (133.56.195.32)


Hello helpdesk

I want to make an effectice area with using arfgen assumed with flat wide field
SKY (approximately 400 arcmin^2). My interested detector region is smaller than
half power diameter (HPD) and there are many small interested region on
detector, MOS1 and MOS2.

Default arfgen filtered detector map, which means SKY, doesn't include PSF
scattering effect because filtered detmap same as the detector region. However,
In my case, due to my interested region is smaller than HPD, PSF scattered
effect is quite significant.

On the other hands, cross region calculation mode contain the PSF scattering
effect from so-called cross region. As described explanation of arfgen, we set
folloing parameters,

spectrumset= "My interested detector region (smaller than HPD)"
detmaptype=flat 
offset="Wide field SKY (400 arcmin^2)" 
bin="adequately fine" 
crossreg_spectrumset="Region around My interested small detector region"

I am not sure how to treat output effective area of cross region calculation
mode. 
But I guess this cross region calculation mode output only contribution of PSF
scattered effect. If so, we must add this cross region effecive area to default
effective area.

Correct?


Reply 1

Resend
From: Rosario Gonzalez Riestra <xmmhelp@sciops.esa.int>
To: kikuchi@astro.isas.jaxa.jp
Subject: Re: Cross region ARF (PR#83401)
Date: Mon May 28 10:14:22 2018
Dear Takahiro Kikuchi,

Your question has been forwarded to the SAS experts. I'll come back to you as
soon as I get their answer.

Regards,

Rosario Gonzalez-Riestra
XMM-SOC User Support Group


Followup 1

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Subject: Re: Cross region ARF (PR#83401)
From: Takahiro Kikuchi <kikuchi@astro.isas.jaxa.jp>
Date: Tue, 29 May 2018 11:46:16 +0900
To: Rosario Gonzalez Riestra <xmmhelp@sciops.esa.int>
Dear Rosario

I`m looking forward to reply.

By the way, can I get filtered detector map of "cross region spectrum" with any
boolean option while we can get filtered detector map of "spectrum" with
filtered set true. 

Taka

> 2018/05/28 19:14...Rosario Gonzalez Riestra <xmmhelp@sciops.esa.int>
...............
> 
> 
> Dear Takahiro Kikuchi,
> 
> Your question has been forwarded to the SAS experts. I'll come back to you
as
> soon as I get their answer.
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Rosario Gonzalez-Riestra
> XMM-SOC User Support Group
> 
> This message is sent for information and/or discussion purposes only.
> It shall neither be binding nor construed as constituting a commitment for
ESA.
> It is intended only for the recipient(s) named above.
> It may contain proprietary information and/or protected content.
> Any unauthorised disclosure, use, retention or dissemination is prohibited.
> If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender
immediately.
> ESA applies appropriate organisational measures to protect personal data.
> In case of data privacy queries, please contact the ESA Data Protection
Officer (dpo@esa.int).
> 
> Thank you.
> 




Reply 2

Resend
From: Rosario Gonzalez Riestra <xmmhelp@sciops.esa.int>
To: kikuchi@astro.isas.jaxa.jp
Subject: Re: Cross region ARF (PR#83401)
Date: Wed May 30 08:17:10 2018
Dear Takahiro Kikuchi

Please find below some comments from the SAS expert to your questions about
arfgen

Regards,

Rosario Gonzalez-Riestra
XMM-SOC User Support Group

============================================

> I want to make an effectice area with using arfgen assumed with flat wide
field
> SKY (approximately 400 arcmin^2).

Do you mean that you want to get the effective area 
for the whole XMM field of view ?

> My interested detector region is smaller than
> half power diameter (HPD) and there are many small interested region on
> detector, MOS1 and MOS2.

Ok. The encircled energy correction is defined down to a 1" radius.

>
> Default arfgen filtered detector map, which means SKY, doesn't include PSF
> scattering effect because filtered detmap same as the detector region. 

The default detector map is a FLAT distribution. You may make an image 
(in detector coords currently) on any spatial scaling that you like, and supply
that to arfgen in the detmaparray parameter.

> However,
> In my case, due to my interested region is smaller than HPD, PSF scattered
> effect is quite significant.

Ok.

>
> On the other hands, cross region calculation mode contain the PSF
scattering
> effect from so-called cross region. As described explanation of arfgen, we
set
> folloing parameters,
>
> spectrumset= "My interested detector region (smaller than HPD)"
> detmaptype=flat
> offset="Wide field SKY (400 arcmin^2)"
> bin="adequately fine"
> crossreg_spectrumset="Region around My interested small detector region"
>
> I am not sure how to treat output effective area of cross region
calculation
> mode.
> But I guess this cross region calculation mode output only contribution of
PSF
> scattered effect. If so, we must add this cross region effecive area to
default
> effective area.
>
> Correct?

Can you send an image with the ouput region and input
region marked so that we can try and understand how to help you with this
problem ?
Also if you could send your spectra and the exact arfgen command that yo uare
using that would also be helpful.



Followup 2

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From: Takahiro Kikuchi <kikuchi@astro.isas.jaxa.jp>
Subject: Re: Cross region ARF (PR#83401)
Date: Thu, 31 May 2018 10:44:18 +0900
To: Rosario Gonzalez Riestra <xmmhelp@sciops.esa.int>
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Hello helpdesk,

Thank you for your reply.
Followings are my reply.

> The default detector map is a FLAT distribution. You may make an image=20=

> (in detector coords currently) on any spatial scaling that you like, =
and supply
> that to arfgen in the detmaparray parameter.
The detmap array parameters are, for example, det(x, y)offset and (x, =
y)bin, right?
These paramters are used to determine detmap shape, however, data =
subspace stored (dss) in spectra file make detmap same as  dss, which is =
called filtered detmap, right?
Because filtered detmap is same as dss, photons coming from outside =
filtered detmap, are not included.
So I=E2=80=98m going to get cross region.

> Can you send an image with the ouput region and input
> region marked so that we can try and understand how to help you with =
this
> problem ?
OK. I attached my image with the input and output image.=20
But we want to set flat SKY so not using image as my SKY but using dss =
information to filter flat detmap.

(Image [output1]: mos1S001-clean_cp_0_set1-image.fits)
(Image [output2]: mos1S001-clean_cp_1-image.fits)
(Image [intput]: prepared only spectra file)


>> My interested detector region is smaller than
>> half power diameter (HPD) and there are many small interested region =
on
>> detector, MOS1 and MOS2.
> Ok. The encircled energy correction is defined down to a 1" radius.

As you can see image sent by me, many a few pixel regions are located on =
detector.
As written in FITS header file, I used 2.5 arcsec/pixel system, so 6 =
pixels is corresponding to 15 arcsec ~ HPD.

I=E2=80=99m going to calculate effective area of the two region (output1 =
and putput2), and then add them.
(That is, photons coming from the input region, which means relative =
flux set 1 on input image and calculate detected photons on the output =
image 1 and image 2)

> Also if you could send your spectra and the exact arfgen command that =
yo uare
> using that would also be helpful.
OK. I attached following spectra files, which have same dss information. =
 =20

(spectra [ouput 1]: mos1S001-clean_cp_0-spectra.fits)
(spectra [output 2]: mos1S001-clean_cp_1-spectra.fits)
(spectra [input cross region spectra]: ) mos1_assumed_sky_spectra.fits

I=E2=80=99m going to add two effective area derived from dss of output =
spectra1 and dss of output spectra2.
If you know how to output not only filtered output detmap but also =
filtered input detmap, please tell me the way.

In addition, our calculated effective area for output1 and output2 are =
attached.


Best regards

Taka



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Reply 3

Resend
From: Rosario Gonzalez Riestra <xmmhelp@sciops.esa.int>
To: kikuchi@astro.isas.jaxa.jp
Subject: Re: Cross region ARF (PR#83401)
Date: Thu May 31 15:37:12 2018
Dear Takahiro Kikuchi,

Please find below further comments from the SAS expert.

Regards,

Rosario Gonzalez-Riestra
XMM-SOC User Support Group

=================================


---
I am afraid that I don't understand what you are trying to do. The cross-ARF
option in arfgen calculates the fraction of flux from an input region (Rin)
which falls in an output region (Rout). These areas have to be separate.
In your case you have an input region which covers most of the field-of-view and
overlaps the output region.

For example maybe you have a small area on the edge of the field of view and you
want to see how the photons from the rest of the sources in the field fall into
that region ? 

If this is the case then you would need to create a spectrum from the rest of
the field (not including your region, Rout) and use detmaparray=<an image of
the
whole field of view with fine pixels>. The routine takes each pixel in the
detmap image and finds the contribution of the PSF in the output area.

But maybe I didn't understand what you really want.
---


Followup 3

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Subject: Re: Cross region ARF (PR#83401)
From: Takahiro Kikuchi <kikuchi@astro.isas.jaxa.jp>
Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2018 12:00:15 +0900
To: Rosario Gonzalez Riestra <xmmhelp@sciops.esa.int>
Hello, helpdesk

Thank you for reply.
Generally, Let...s think of S.. conservation where S means effective area and
omega is solid angle.

> The cross-ARF option in arfgen calculates the fraction of flux from an
input region (Rin) which falls in an output region (Rout). These areas have to
be separate.
> In your case you have an input region which covers most of the
field-of-view and overlaps the output region.


The arfgen should be conserve S.. if detmap is flat, right?
When a radius Rin is lager than radius Rout,
 
Omega_in = pi (R_in)^2  
Omega_out = pi (R_out)^2  
Omega_annulus = Omega_in - Omega_out  .

I means equation below, 
S_in*Omega_in = S_out*Omega_out + S_annulus*Omega_annulus,

where S_in means effective area that is flux coming from entire field, Omega_in.
Why is that region should be separate? I think the overlap region should be not
problem.
Is there any notation in arfgen explanation text. I think that I know filter to
detmap using data sub space stored in spectra file.

Best regards

Taka

> 2018/06/01 0:37...Rosario Gonzalez Riestra <xmmhelp@sciops.esa.int>
...............
> 
> 
> Dear Takahiro Kikuchi,
> 
> Please find below further comments from the SAS expert.
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Rosario Gonzalez-Riestra
> XMM-SOC User Support Group
> 
> =================================
> 
> 
> ---
> I am afraid that I don't understand what you are trying to do. The
cross-ARF
> option in arfgen calculates the fraction of flux from an input region (Rin)
> which falls in an output region (Rout). These areas have to be separate.
> In your case you have an input region which covers most of the
field-of-view and
> overlaps the output region.
> 
> For example maybe you have a small area on the edge of the field of view
and you
> want to see how the photons from the rest of the sources in the field fall
into
> that region ? 
> 
> If this is the case then you would need to create a spectrum from the rest
of
> the field (not including your region, Rout) and use detmaparray=<an
image of the
> whole field of view with fine pixels>. The routine takes each pixel in
the
> detmap image and finds the contribution of the PSF in the output area.
> 
> But maybe I didn't understand what you really want.
> ---
> 
> 
> This message is sent for information and/or discussion purposes only.
> It shall neither be binding nor construed as constituting a commitment for
ESA.
> It is intended only for the recipient(s) named above.
> It may contain proprietary information and/or protected content.
> Any unauthorised disclosure, use, retention or dissemination is prohibited.
> If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender
immediately.
> ESA applies appropriate organisational measures to protect personal data.
> In case of data privacy queries, please contact the ESA Data Protection
Officer (dpo@esa.int).
> 
> Thank you.
> 




Reply 4

Resend
From: Rosario Gonzalez Riestra <xmmhelp@sciops.esa.int>
To: kikuchi@astro.isas.jaxa.jp
Subject: Re: Cross region ARF (PR#83401)
Date: Fri Jun  1 14:56:49 2018
Dear Taka,

Further answers to your questions.

Regards

Rosario
===================================================

For a flat detector map you are right that

S_in*Omega_in = S_out*Omega_out + S_annulus*Omega_annulu

if S stands for surface brightness, i.e. flux per deg^2. This has nothing to do
with the effective area.

The effective area of a small region is exactly the same as the effective area
of a large region for an extended source.

I am sorry, I still don't understand what quantity you are trying to calculate.

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